Service going downhill at Tangerine | Tangerine Bank | Discussion forum

james1900 said

Just a speculation, they might kill Tang. Just like RBC's kill on Ally savings.

They won't kill Tangerine. BNS' purchase of ING DIRECT Canada and RY's purchase of the Ally Canada assets were for dramatically different reasons; BNS was seen as the "least capitalized" on the deposit side of things (if you can call it that; all Canadian banks are well-capitalized) and wanted ING DIRECT Canada almost exclusively for its deposit base and, to a lesser extent, its mutual fund business was complementary. They've made their big changes as far as ending product or business lines goes: they ended the relationship with deposit brokers, then with mortgage brokers to give Scotiabank less competition in the mortgage broker channel (where it remains the #1 originating lender) and put about $20 billion of ING DIRECT Canada's $25 billion mortgage portfolio into "run-off" (i.e., that means, for a variety of reason(s), they'll continue to renew those mortgages but not advance any new funds for those existing mortgages as, presumably, they don't meet BNS' lending matrix).

RY, on the other hand, bought Ally Canada's assets almost exclusively for the auto financing and dealer "floor plan" and leasing business. The deposit(s), if any, were just a "side show". Even with the commotion, they still managed to retain probably two thirds of their miniscule $1.5 billion in deposits (which isn't bad) and you have to hand it to them: it may have been a somewhat "disruptive" transition in things like, new account numbers and forcing clients to re-link their external accounts and pre-authorized debit agreements. However, they did it quick and migrated everyone to the RBC Royal Bank platform (which they likely had to do, since Ally retained the technology infrastructure). Contrast that to TD Canada Trust which took three years moving MBNA Canada to the TD Canada Trust technology platform and, even still, don't allow in-branch access to MBNA credit cards (though at least now they could, in theory, if they wanted to) and they've still retained the horrid MBNA (which stands for Maryland Bank, National Association, if anyone's curious) and CUETS brands as unincorporated divisions of TD Canada Trust.

I think what Tangerine didn't anticipate is BNS' relentless control of costs and how that doesn't square with an innovative/disruptive culture of Tangerine. They're trying to innovate, as best they can, focusing on "big picture" things like ChequeIn, voice authentication and fingerprint sensing in iOS but having to dramatically slow the pace of innovation. Would they be better off with a different shareholder than BNS? Maybe, but doubtful as BNS is, at least, letting them "chart their own path" and mostly staying clear of day-to-day decision-making. That said, I do wonder if Tangerine's "direct bank" business model will at some point clash with Scotia's full-service model as I wonder if, perhaps, Scotia banking customers switching to Tangerine is, perhaps, bigger than Scotia realized. It's just speculation but perhaps that's playing a role in the slower roll-out of new Tangerine features also? I know from my own perspective, I've moved my chequing/savings account(s) from Scotia to Tangerine, have got my parents to do the same (so they don't have to maintain minimum monthly balances) and even my sister is slowly migrating. I wonder, how many "hybrid" Scotia/Tangerine customers like me, having Tangerine banking and Scotia iTRADE customers are there? If so, what does that mean for a possible reduction in Scotia's branch network footprint (already the smallest or second-smallest of the "Big 5"), let alone any possible growth?

It's still early days, troubling signs have emerged. Tangerine was supposed to launch an unsecured Personal Line of Credit product by "end of Q3 2014," at the latest (that would be July 31st, 2014 for those tracking that sort of thing) and didn't. A credit card was pushed back to "mid-2015," but, even that, I suspect might be pushed out to 2016 or possibly even 2017 as they only completed their project management team hiring in late 2014.

I'm sticking with them, though, because they are still "best-in-class".

Cheers,
Doug

I had to call them last week around 5PM. Took over 15 minutes to talk to someone. No biggie for me.

Long time customer of them, since 1998. I'm not happy about the change of ownership and the slowing of innovation that it brought.

1. The change of ATM network, while good for some, is not for most in Quebec. It's easy to find a Banque Nationale ATM. A Scotia one? Not so much. They exist but they are few and far between in some areas, completely absent in others.

2. ING used to lead in interest and mortgage rates. As most here know, not anymore.

3. I initiated a transfer out of a Tangerine RRSP in the first week of last December. Tangerine would only confirm to the company that initiated the transfer that they received the document but, somehow, the funds still stayed with Tangerine. After 6 weeks, I decided to call and was informed that yes, they received the transfer request in December but would not process it because it was not signed by me.

They did not inform the company that sent them the request and had no plan to inform me either. The request would simply be stuck in limbo for ever so I'm now stuck and will have to pay the transfer out fee.

I asked them to credit the fee and they will not, even when I explained politely I would take all my business elsewhere.

ING was a market disruptor. It's obvious that it's not anymore. I think we sadly need competition.

Loonie: I agree. Tangerine says the form is not signed. The firm that sent the request sent me a PDF of the form and it is signed by me. He says, she says... Yes, I'll be reimbursed when I finally transfer out.

I also agree about the upsell. It is getting annoying. I see it as spam. It's annoying to most but since they keep doing it, it must be because some clients of theirs accept their offers...

The whole thing is just a letdown. ING used to be a company I was proud to do business with. Not anymore.

Good to read that your family member's transfer from Tangerine was promptly handled, Loonie.

It would be sad if Tangerine now routinely resorted to the tactics described in Glenn Szlagowski's article to stymie requests to transfer out.

Hard to say if their selective matching of competitors is a sign of worry over market share. Maybe Tangerine can't have a general market-leading offer without having ScotiaBank take up their entire offer! If Tangerine was planning to offer everyone something like 2% to boost their deposits, their parent (ScotiaBank) might nix the plan by offering to deposit the money Tangerine was hoping for, for something like 1¾% minus whatever the CDIC premium would have been.

ScotiaBank would be happy because they would only get around ½% if they parked the funds instead in Government of Canada treasury bills.

malquin said
The whole thing is just a letdown. ING used to be a company I was proud to do business with. Not anymore.

Ditto. They have gone from being the primary keeper of my RSP's to last choice. When my final GIC matures next march, it will be transferred out so all I have left with them is the line of credit account...which I don't use. Bad CS, gimmicky promos and (most of all) the drop in rates has turned a once innovative company into just another puppet of one of the big 5. Sad

I cannot directly answer your question. I have difficulty dealing with any bank that is a spinoff or engined by of one of the big 5.

If you are looking for solid rates without a lot of frills.
Hubert
Oaken
Accelerate

I use Tangerine (formerly ING) for Chequing & cash segregation (savings).. Reg savings @ hubert and TFSA Cash @ PTC..

I've never had issues with ING or Tang.. Alot quicker to get an agent then @ TD no matte the time of day.

With the recent changes at Tang they definately don't want any registered money due to fees..

Edit: I do think we have a lot more competition then when ING started.. Just called Tang @ 2pm EST (Sunday) an got an agent immediately. 3 min total call for verification/balance check and Whoops protection question..