Good news keep coming: Bitcoin plunges below $24,000 | Page 8 | Investing | Discussion forum

Looks like I touched the very nerve I mentioned.

I used the word investment once in the last comment as a general placeholder word like a layman. My mistake. If improper use of the term leads to upsetting you this much, I can’t help you.

I’ve made it clear I’m well aware it’s a bet/speculation, as I said, I wouldn’t be trying to time the fall if at all possible; just was curious about any channels to bet against it long term. If none exist that’s fine. Again, nothing nice to say, don’t say it. Have a good day.

finance trance said

No where in that page does it show a specific premium number for a specific duration put option, plus any other specific metrics which I don't understand. What may be self-evident to one person, is not to others.

not sure what u meant, google search returns web links that one is supposed to click to see....

And if u do click on the links google returns, which is what most people do, you will see this screen shot. Again not sure if u did and saw that, what else are u confused about.

Lodown said
What is being missed here is that Bitcoin has somehow managed to be the world's first 'perpetual ponzi scheme'. It has all the right elements as follows:

0. Bitcoin as a currency has unparalleled features.
1. Available worldwide.
2. Most of the world does not own any but ownership expansion is slow but always on an upward trajectory.
3. There are untold Bitcoin pumpers in the world.
4. The last of the 21 million bitcoins will be mined around 2040, so lots of hype and new owners to come.

So yes, Bitcoin has relentless demand, and as such the price will keep going up...but not in a straight line. Pumpers have quoted 1M USD a coin is coming. I can see it happening before 2040.........UNLESS........the US central bank issues it own government backed "USACoin" with all the benefits and none of the drawbacks of Bitcoin. And yes, the US, Canada and many other central banks are already looking into it.

Bottom line: Buyer beware!  

I stand by the post above.

Since this topic was started in 2022 the price of BTC is up 500-600%. If you missed out on this massive run-up, there will be another opportunity. Just need to put the old 'Thinkolator' to work.

With BTC just off it's all time high of $109,993 USD on January 21, 2025.
What price do your crystal balls see for one BTC by December 31, 2025?

In what year in the future do you see it hitting 1 Million USD or if pessimistic $0.00?

mmlt said
I can't help but snicker re visiting this thread. Don't despair naysayers, you can still make a buck on the imaginary money. Trump and his buddy Musk have lots of bitcoins and you can be sure they'll drive the price even higher.  

I don't think the big boys are buy and hold. They're probably using AI and sophisticated algorithms to buy and sell Bitcoin and stow the gains in real assets because this ponzi is probably easier to predict than the stock market. They also have a lot of influence on the price of Bitcoin.

I wonder how much Trump and his cronies made when the markets plunged and then recovered after his tariffs and pause.

Can I get physical Bitcoin like Gold?

4. The last of the 21 million bitcoins will be mined around 2040, so lots of hype and new owners to come.

Apparently it's 2140.

savemoresaveoften said

Madoff last more than 17 years.

I do agree bitcoin is not a ponzi scheme at all. People uses the term ponzi scheme so loosely and most dont understand how it actually works.  

If it is not a ponzi scheme what kind of a scheme is it?

mordko said

savemoresaveoften said

Madoff last more than 17 years.

 

He did but his fraud didn’t.  

Per google search, it spans decades. Maybe u know more than me.

savemoresaveoften said

Per google search, it spans decades. Maybe u know more than me.  

I admit its not clear and possibly depends on whether you view payments for order flow as part of his Ponzi scheme (I don’t).

From wiki:

“ Federal investigators believe the fraud in the investment management division and advisory division may have begun in the 1970s.[27] However, Madoff himself stated his fraudulent activities began in the 1990s.[28] Madoff's fraudulent activities are believed to have accelerated after the 2001 change from fractional share trades to decimals on the NYSE, which cut significantly into his legitimate profits as a market-maker.[29] With fractional trades Madoff profited up to 12.5 cents per share with each trade handled by his firm, but following decimalization this bid ask spread between sellers and buyers was reduced to as low as one cent.
In the 1980s, Madoff's market-maker division traded up to 5% of the total volume made on the NYSE.[21] Madoff was "the first prominent practitioner"[30] of payment for order flow, paying brokers to execute their clients' orders through his brokerage, a practice some have called a "legal kickback".[31] This practice gave Madoff the distinction of being the largest dealer in NYSE-listed stocks in the U.S., trading about 15% of transaction volume.[32] Academics have questioned the ethics of these payments.[33][34] Madoff has argued that these payments did not alter the price that the customer received.[35] He viewed payments for order flow as a normal business practice: "If your girlfriend goes to buy stockings at a supermarket, the racks that display those stockings are usually paid for by the company that manufactured the stockings. Order flow is an issue that attracted a lot of attention but is grossly overrated."[35]”

mordko said

This is a red herring. If gold was priced as a commodity it wouldn’t cost anywhere near $4K an ounce. The price of gold is entirely defined by its perceived value as an investment and to diversify risk.

Countries hold gold reserves for reasons very different from needing jewelry in an emergency.

When things go crazy, price of gold shoots up even though people buy less jewelry. With actual commodities prices drop like a stone when demand for goods tanks in a recession.  

I agree, that it wouldn't cost anywhere near $4K.
I'm not sure how much it cost to produce one ounce of gold, but I think approximately around $1.5K Canadian now and certainly not more, that $2K.