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Email this6:47 pm
May 26, 2022
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Currently at 5.39%
7:22 pm
March 30, 2017
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NCC1701Z said
Currently at 5.39%
thats gross yield. mgmt fee is 0.10%, MER 0.11%
9:07 pm
August 14, 2023
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savemoresaveoften said
thats gross yield. mgmt fee is 0.10%, MER 0.11%
The 5.39% is calculated by taking the current dividend amount (.225) x 12 months (2.70) going forward divided by the current ETF value at the time 50.14 ( Horizons chose Aug.18th) comes out to 5.3849 . Round up equals the 5.39%.
These returns are more theoretical. Firstly, this rate assumes that every month for next 12 the amount will be constant. This most likely will not occur. the days in each month's dividend cycle are not equal. Generally there is an average of 28 days + or - 3 days. Due to the underlying assets being money held in daily savings accounts both duration and un-contractual terms will vary the monthly dividend amounts. In this case, the .225 dividend amount was based a longer than average monthly dividend cycle, 33 days.
I purchased CASH ETF on the ex. dividend day at $50. Therefore my rate of return equals 5.4%. Consider any posted returns as a thereabouts kind of Yield. Always workout the math! Make sure you know what the upcoming dividend amount will be.
BTW, Since the rate is based on the dividend amount. The return is actually after the management fee and expense ratio. So net yield.
Trader first, Saver second
11:06 pm
May 26, 2022
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I guess the point of my post was lost. It's ~1.5% higher than any HISA offering and just as liquid.
4:45 am
March 30, 2017
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TINAisOver said
The 5.39% is calculated by taking the current dividend amount (.225) x 12 months (2.70) going forward divided by the current ETF value at the time 50.14 ( Horizons chose Aug.18th) comes out to 5.3849 . Round up equals the 5.39%.
These returns are more theoretical. Firstly, this rate assumes that every month for next 12 the amount will be constant. This most likely will not occur. the days in each month's dividend cycle are not equal. Generally there is an average of 28 days + or - 3 days. Due to the underlying assets being money held in daily savings accounts both duration and un-contractual terms will vary the monthly dividend amounts. In this case, the .225 dividend amount was based a longer than average monthly dividend cycle, 33 days.
I purchased CASH ETF on the ex. dividend day at $50. Therefore my rate of return equals 5.4%. Consider any posted returns as a thereabouts kind of Yield. Always workout the math! Make sure you know what the upcoming dividend amount will be.
BTW, Since the rate is based on the dividend amount. The return is actually after the management fee and expense ratio. So net yield.
Nope, the monthly div is 100% NOT .225 every month. Also using 50.14 as your cost is also wrong. So no the 5.39% is not post fee nor MER.
One just have to go to their web site and it will tell you, what’s gross yield, and how much fee is coming out that. No assumptions or calculation required.
As for liquidity, depends if u willing to hit a bid when time to sell. Time lapse to access the fund will be between 2-3 days, depends how good your brokerage is to execute and post the transaction in ur account.
But yes totally better place to park cash than those ‘low interest’ HISA !
7:49 am
October 27, 2013
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The bid-ask spread is one cent on these Cash ETFs and settlement is T+1. I consider that "liquid" since no one should be surprised by 'waiting 2 days' for funds. The bigger issue for me would be the $10 buy/sell commissions at the discount brokerages I use, albeit for buying/selling $100k at a time, the commission gets lost in the rounding. It is also less relevant the longer one holds.
That is a good reason for me to use brokerage ISAs such as BMO's BMT104 @ 4.65% or Scotia's DYN6004 @ 5% instead (no buy/sell commissions) making small 3-4 digit buys or sells cost effective.
The value of each type of product is specific to the investor/saver.
8:59 am
January 12, 2019
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.
And FWIW ... the ETF CASH.T is not insured, but ISAs are.
Sorry, I just had to throw that in. 
- Dean
" Live Long, Healthy ... And Prosper! "
9:09 am
August 14, 2023
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savemoresaveoften said
Nope, the monthly div is 100% NOT .225 every month. Also using 50.14 as your cost is also wrong. So no the 5.39% is not post fee nor MER.
One just have to go to their web site and it will tell you, what’s gross yield, and how much fee is coming out that. No assumptions or calculation required.
As for liquidity, depends if u willing to hit a bid when time to sell. Time lapse to access the fund will be between 2-3 days, depends how good your brokerage is to execute and post the transaction in ur account.
But yes totally better place to park cash than those ‘low interest’ HISA !
I respectfully disagree. I don't understand your statement of gross amount based on the rate posted by Horizons ETF's since the MER ad Management fee is already worked into the NAV and Div. amount and and an investor is actually achieving the yield based on the dividend amount paid.
The yield is matched if an investor meets the conditions specified by Horizons. The ETF price paid, I used the closing price of 50.14 on August 18. ( Horizons Doesn't actually state specifically what that purchase price is on that date, but the range is negligible) and an annualized dividend amount (as per the .225 x 12) equals the yield . This is their formula not mine as to the information found on their website , https://horizonsetfs.com/ETF/cash/.
At no point is there an additional fee to the investor from horizons to reduce the stated yield afterwards. To me I consider this the bottom line, or in other words the net value.
The only other cost that would be a fee /commission from the brokerage that would reduce your total return on investment which has nothing to with Horizons.
I agree with your liquidity statement . The price the investor is willing to pay is at their discretion . Regarding the Time lapse of 2-3 days I'm not sure what you are referring to . The funds available from sell orders made in brokerages involving stocks and ETF's are instantaneous. I assume you are referring to the settlement time. This is a given and is manageable even without having a margin account.
Trader first, Saver second
11:07 am
October 27, 2013
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TINAisOver said
Regarding the Time lapse of 2-3 days I'm not sure what you are referring to . The funds available from sell orders made in brokerages involving stocks and ETF's are instantaneous. I assume you are referring to the settlement time. This is a given and is manageable even without having a margin account.
The proceeds are available immediately if used to purchase something else with a T+1 or T+2 settlement, but the proceeds are not available as cash that can be withdrawn immediately. The proceeds are not available as cash until settlement.
As for gross vs net yield, one needs to be careful what they look at on any given day at https://horizonsetfs.com/ETF/cash/ As of Aug 18, 2023, Horizons is advertising a GROSS yield of 5.39% which means the net yield to investor is 5.39% less 0.11% MER. However, the quoted 'annualized distribution yield' of 5.4% and '12 month trailing yield' of 4.4% are indeed net to the investor and based on Sept 1, 2023 data. Trusts, as in ETFs, have yields that technically can change every single trading day as the underlying holdings will change every business day.
Folks who are buying any kind of flow through trust, whether ETFs or Money Market mutual funds need to understand not to micro-manage yields. They are what they are when posted...as historical data in the rear view mirror. Don't buy these things if you are upset by daily/weekly/monthly variations of 10-30bp.
12:48 pm
February 14, 2023
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is there a list of discount brokerages that allows the buy/sell of cash.to?
2:27 pm
January 12, 2019
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- Sorry ... not that I know of, Kesa ⬆
All I can say is that I'm quite surprised that the discount broker I deal with
(TD's TDDI/WebBroker) does list the CASH ETF as available to invest in ❗
However, I'm still inclined to stick with their ISAs instead, as they are CDIC Insured, there's no buy/sell trading fees, no management fees, and their
interest rates are respectable.
To each, their own
- Dean
" Live Long, Healthy ... And Prosper! "
3:38 pm
October 27, 2013
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kesa said
is there a list of discount brokerages that allows the buy/sell of cash.to?
Ask your current brokerage if they do. I don't see much value in opening a brokerage account just for Cash ETFs, or for that matter, ISAs. The yields on all of these, including Money Market mutual funds, will come down as central bank interest rates come down some years hence (your guess is as good as mine).
5:18 pm
March 30, 2017
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AltaRed said
The proceeds are available immediately if used to purchase something else with a T+1 or T+2 settlement, but the proceeds are not available as cash that can be withdrawn immediately. The proceeds are not available as cash until settlement.
As for gross vs net yield, one needs to be careful what they look at on any given day at https://horizonsetfs.com/ETF/cash/ As of Aug 18, 2023, Horizons is advertising a GROSS yield of 5.39% which means the net yield to investor is 5.39% less 0.11% MER. However, the quoted 'annualized distribution yield' of 5.4% and '12 month trailing yield' of 4.4% are indeed net to the investor and based on Sept 1, 2023 data. Trusts, as in ETFs, have yields that technically can change every single trading day as the underlying holdings will change every business day.
Folks who are buying any kind of flow through trust, whether ETFs or Money Market mutual funds need to understand not to micro-manage yields. They are what they are when posted...as historical data in the rear view mirror. Don't buy these things if you are upset by daily/weekly/monthly variations of 10-30bp.
Thank you for the explanation and point out that the 5.39% is NOT the real yield one will actually receive over a year, unlike a one year GIC at 5.39%.
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